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Anonymous asked:

why are pyro and heavy considered low level classes? it's hard to reflect rockets sometimes and do everything at once as pyro, i don't know why people get so upset at pyro and heavy people :(

uberchain:

You’ll see the salty taste in 6s player’s mouths because purists so I’m gonna talk about this strictly from a 6v6 environment because complaining about Pyros and Heavies in HL is ass backwards as all hell, and being better with reflect timing or tracking at Pyro and Heavy, as well as not giving a fuck about what people say about you in HL makes sense. People in 6s don’t like Pyro and Heavy because they are hard counter classes, especially Pyro lately when the Heavy nerf happened. IIRC BUDSQUAD has tried to run Seanbud on Heavy main but something feels off about it, and I’m not sure if it’s their team cohesion or just that people know how to focus fire a Heavy.

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Okay. So when people complain to you that “none of these classes take skill”, what they mean to say is “I am getting denied the fuck out of something that should not work this effectively because the skill cap for it is lower than my class”. Nobody likes popping Uber and then get airblasted into a corner by a Pyro no matter where they go, or have their projectiles reflected which means now they have to rely on lesser damage guns unless Scout can shoot meat. When Pyro is in close range, Pyro does work and it is very hard to combat that in 6s due to the way Solly and Demo are set up and due to afterburn/juggle advantage. Does this mean you’re doing a good job defending? Yes, and it’s going to be frustrating as fuck to kill you if you’re denying us all the time and people are backing you up, making us think harder of “ok who do we send in or how are we going in, do we distract or do we focus fire, what do”. Does that mean you’re good at Pyro? That’s where the controversy starts.

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People want to face off against classes they feel “deserve” the reward of winning such as Scout or Soldier, or even Demo if they’re not bitching about M1 + M2. 6s meta off-classes like Heavy tanks out massive damage and once he’s buffed up with heals he’s very hard to kill. Pyro isn’t that complex in terms of what to do compared to other classes, M1 and M2 both get the job done and Degreaser is incredible with a switch. Pyro and Heavy take less prediction than Scout or Soldier, it is far easier to land “shots” with those classes than any of the main damage dealers of 6s until/unless you are focus fired or taken down. Pyro and Heavy can be killed, they can be countered - but that is not the point. The skill cap for them is lower. You could argue “but Demo is just M1 + M2 or Soldier is just shoot people’s feet and splash range is so big, and Scouts are everywhere, and Pyro is weak with no long-range combat!”. Pipes are a bitch to land, stickies land in weird places or take some time to charge up for distance, shooting the ground doesn’t always work, juggling that shot sucks if you’re no good at predicting, jumping is so easy to fuck up, practicing a rollout for 30 minutes is tiring, Scout is a fragile weakling without buffs, what the fuck is pistol registrationand how do you shoot things when you run fast how even. Pyro runs in and airblasts, all projectiles and people get denied unless Quickfixed/they fuck up the timing/Pyro get shot, finishes you with either a shotty or the flare gun/afterburn. Heavy stands on point and fires with a Medic on him, people run far away unless they can focus fire because he’s so tanked on heals.   

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We’re focusing on Pyro more since I think that’s the class most people get mad at. The thing that pisses people off most about Pyro is airblast - mini-crits being next and fast weapon switch being a side dish. All of these things are easier to learn than most things. I run Degreaser/Flare Gun/Powerjack. Pyro becomes muscle memory in pubs and sometimes I don’t realize that I’ve Powerjack charged in, flamed on, airblasted, pulled out flare gun, finished it because of how fast and instinctively it happens. With Heavy just call Medic, hop around, hold down M1 and track good; how much shots you’re putting out will do the rest of the work for you. I don’t have to line up my shots, I don’t have to necessarily predict where I’m going to shoot because I know my range is wider and my chances of killing/damaging shit is better compared to landing pipes or shooting people with a shotty or a scatter. I still get killed, I still get denied back once people have figured out how to deny me because my response time/gamesense isn’t good/the other guy is better. But while I have fun with Pyro and Heavy and I do like playing as them in a relaxed environment (read: a pub, though I’d like to try Heavy in an Iron or Steel team), I feel like Scout, Demo, and even Sniper on the blue moon is more rewarding because if I’m landing shots it means I’m getting better at aiming and prediction due to how much smaller your range is with a gun or a direct pill than the bigger range of a flamethrower or a minigun.   

The low ceiling thing is covered best by Tagg here for Pyro though don’t read the rest of the comments since it’s 6v6 circlejerking I’d rather if you like Pyro you don’t Tagg’s comments already makes it clear he doesn’t like Pyro, except his post is good in terms of an opinion with solid facts. He basically talks about how easy it is to stack up Pyro with a lot of buffs based on the unlocks Valve has given (ignoring nerfed Axtinguisher as well as other outdated stats). Also, as said before, airblast has so much denial power it’s insane, but I understand why it’s in the game and my name is testament to why airblast is necessary. Are these things that should make you feel bad as a Pyro or Heavy main? No, if you want to keep doing what you’re doing and if you run full-time Pyro in 6v6, keep doing it. But the MUH META players will always ragequit a scrim against your team, always bitch about you, always try to find some reason to get mad because you’ve basically come in and shoved them back due to your radius of fire (get it?) being greater than the time they’ve put into trying to learn how to land their tinier-radius shots that need to land with the intent to kill-deny rather than bigger-radius aim somewhere close enough near the hitbox and then deny-deny.

I don’t like facing Pyros in 6s or dealing with a frustrating one on last, and I might even BM you because based on what I was surrounded by full-time Pyro/Heavy on a 6s game is considered BM (even though Valve wants the meta to change and the purists are clinging on) - but by all means if that’s what floats your boat then you can do that, it’s your choice and if you have fun with it more than HOW DO LAND SHOTS AS SCOUT, then go for it. Bathe in the tears of your enemies. As Lange said: “Is it working? Are they winning? It’s viable”.

To throw in my two cents as well, a pyro with a phlogistinator and Scorch shot is good for area denying as well. Granted not as good as air blasting. But the damage a pyro can throw out is amazing. I’ve cleared a whole enemy team from pushing because I built up with my Scorch shot. Then later on get bitched at for M+1 Granted I did my job of clearing and or protecting my base. Another two cents as well. Heavy needs some more buffs and can be a hard class to play, from as you said people tend to focus you down. But playing as a lone heavy can be jolly good fun when you take a good chunk of the enemy team down and someone goes medic because they know you can dish out the support and aid your team (Via Sandwich, which I heal anyone who needs it). But hey, spamming someone out with pills or rockets is balanced as to having a lumbering beast or keep control of an area and protecting team mates. (I also do play a lot of Demo and Soldier, but I do roll banner for the most part. That as a demo I try to use my grenade launcher more so I don’t depend on Sticky spamming. Unless the enemy team tries to shove themselves down my throat or i there is a medic, Heavy combo) But that’s just me.

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